Considering a siphon feed airbrush

[Andhson]

Hej,

I am mainly using my ab for painting fishing baits. This far I have been using an Iwata Eclipse gravity feed with a 0.35 needle and createx. Since I find myself using more or less a few paint mixes for example for the belly, back, eyes etc and want to switch between them easily I have started to consider adding an eclipse siphon feed to the toolbox.

I have browsed the forum a bit and found some advice on bottle blowout traps etc, but not much answering my basic question, is there anyhing special to consider when it comes siphon feed airbrushes? All answers are much appreciated

To give you some idea what I want to use it for...

 

[haasje dutchairbrush]

is there anyhing special to consider when it comes siphon feed airbrushes? All answers are much appreciated

As these are mostly used for larger areas an thus in general are 0.35 or bigger I don't think there is anything special to consider. With detail brushes you get into things like airpressure, spray pattern etc, but with a siphon feed the only requierment most of the time will be it has to spray paint .

As long as you stick to the "better" brands I don't realy think you can go wrong. I myself like the Iwata revolution as it has a screw on the brush above the thingie you stick the bottle in which makes for verry easy cleaning.

 

[KustomCandy]

Sounds like your on the right track. Just be aware of the needle size before ordering. Many (Iwata's particularly) are .05 needles. I think (off my head) the BCS is optional of .03 needle set up.

For bottles falling off. I have seen guys use 3M 'Blue' tape (Any tape would suffice tho) that they run up the side of the bottle over the brush and down the other side of the bottle. Swapping over, just rip the tape off and go again.

Dan

 

[RebelAir]

Sounds like it may help a bit, especially with multiple color needs, you can get siphons also doing sweet detail especially with Badgers Fine line Conversion that fits a few of its siphon feeds. but any brand name will do alright though would be a good idea to keep an eye on needle sizes as mentioned..Good luck, nice lures btw

 

[Andhson]

Ah, I missed that the siphon feed has the 0,5 needle, I did try that in my eclipse and it almost drove me mad, I very much prefer the 0,35.

Would there be any problems converting the siphon feed back to 0,35?

 

[AndreZA]

I'm sure you don't use a lot of paint for the lures. So you can either get the Badger or Paasche cups for the BCS or get the SBS side feed and get a bunch of Aztek cups for that.

 

[KustomCandy]

Ah, I missed that the siphon feed has the 0,5 needle, I did try that in my eclipse and it almost drove me mad, I very much prefer the 0,35.

Would there be any problems converting the siphon feed back to 0,35?

Mate, the Iwata BCS. A suction fed CS basically. So it'll feel like your CS, minus that bottle hanging down. Has the option of using a .35 needle/nozzle. So you could just swap your spare CS parts over if you had any. Or just order the outfit with the .35 set up..... BOTH needle and Nozzle, dont forget!

http://www.airbrushmegastore.com/images/stories/iwata/airbrushes/eclipse/BCS/eclipse bcs.pdf

Dan

 

[Andhson]

I'm sure you don't use a lot of paint for the lures. So you can either get the Badger or Paasche cups for the BCS or get the SBS side feed and get a bunch of Aztek cups for that.

True, this is more about efficiency and consistency than large amount of paint.

 

[jaystacy]

Just a thought I'd guess ya blast alot of one color as base then use 2 others for details. Why not a semi cheap bottle with .5 for that main color then stick with your current brush for details?

 

[jaystacy]

Sorry phone hickuped and double posted.

 

[Andhson]

Just a thought I'd guess ya blast alot of one color as base then use 2 others for details. Why not a semi cheap bottle with .5 for that main color then stick with your current brush for details?

The thing is that I use a hybrid tech with a epoxy laminated photo as base so my "base paint" have to go on with quite a bit of control on very limited amounts and areas, overspray is one of my bigger challenges. I tried the .5 needle and it sprays way to wide.

What I am looking for is more painting time an less mix and clean time. My idea i rather to have two of the same ab (just for comfort and peace of mind) and use bottles for mixes I use frequently and use the gravity feed for any special color mixes. I am happy with the eclipse in the 0.35 needle setup, it has just the right spray pattern for the application.

 

[Nessus]

Main thing in my (admittedly limited) experience is that siphon feeds require a higher minimum air pressure than gravity feeds, 'cause the Venturi effect has to be strong enough to suck the paint up from the bottle all by itself. Siphon feeds won't work at pressures below 20psi or so, whereas gravity (and side, I'm told) can be pushed down to half that or lower. Whether that's an issue or not depends on the sort of work you do.

As a modeller I like having the ability to go low pressure, as 20psi and above can actually exert a lot of force on small parts when working up close, causing them to deflect and/or shift, or to even dislodge and go flying. Also any paint that's still wet can get blown around by higher pressures up close, so lower pressures are "safer" and easier to control in that context. Dunno how comparable that is to painting lures. I imagine it depends on the size of the lure and how they're secured during painting.

I don't have a side feed, but my understanding is they kind of allow the best of both worlds: color changeability like a siphon fed, w/ the low minimum pressure of a gravity feed.

 

[jagardn]

I'm sure you don't use a lot of paint for the lures. So you can either get the Badger or Paasche cups for the BCS or get the SBS side feed and get a bunch of Aztek cups for that.

I was going to suggest the SBS also. Somewhere I saw a bottle feed attachment for it. It's next on my list, though I don't need the bottle feed. I figure that I love my HP-CS and my Olympos HP-200SB, so the HP-SBS seemed like a obvious choice for my next brush.

 

[RebelAir]

Ah, I missed that the siphon feed has the 0,5 needle, I did try that in my eclipse and it almost drove me mad, I very much prefer the 0,35.

Would there be any problems converting the siphon feed back to 0,35?

Depends which type you get...Badger do have the ability to use a smaller needle with a conversion kit, some other siphon brands may have similar. The original Badger 150 came with a fine, medium and course needle with each head assembly, pain in the bum to change needles out all the time but it does then give you a siphon with a smaller detail needle..Best of luck..Fits the patriot and the anthem, not sure what others it may fit..

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Rev7/6301-6400/rev6373-Badger-Patriot105-41-044/00.shtm

 

[Andhson]

Working air pressure is definitely important since overspray is an issue, I try to stay below 20psi to avoid having paint all over the place. Seems maybe I should be looking at a side feed with bottles instead?

 

[jagardn]

Working air pressure is definitely important since overspray is an issue, I try to stay below 20psi to avoid having paint all over the place. Seems maybe I should be looking at a side feed with bottles instead?

If you're concerned about it, why not mix your paint in a bottle and just add more to the cup of your CS as needed. It would save you from buying an airbrush they you may not like.

 

[AndreZA]

The guns that uses the least amount of pressure are the gravity feeds. If you're going to use a bottle on a side feed, you will basically change it to a bottom feed and requires more air pressure. And the thicker the paint, the more pressure it also needs.

 

[Andhson]

Hmm, I suspected as much, so basically I should stick with the gravity feed. Thanks guys, this is exactly why I started this thread. Saved me some pain and money.

 

[AndreZA]

Hmm, I suspected as much, so basically I should stick with the gravity feed. Thanks guys, this is exactly why I started this thread. Saved me some pain and money.

No, just saying, if you want quick colour changes and you will use small amounts of paint, get a side feed and use the cups provided.

 

[RebelAir]

Working air pressure is definitely important since overspray is an issue, I try to stay below 20psi to avoid having paint all over the place. Seems maybe I should be looking at a side feed with bottles instead?

Then your back to the same type of color change issue, prob easier than a gravity but still not as quick as a siphon. Perhaps just easier to stick with what you have, I only started with a gravity and got darn quick at color changes simply by placing a container of warm soapy water beside me, tip excess paint into bottle, submerge the whole brush and spray through, a quick backflush, wipe and new color..Sounds a lot but that takes about 25-30 seconds You save yourself about 20 seconds on the gravity feed but realistically unless your in manufacturer mode like TShirts or such that 20 seconds don't matter

You could also simply line 5 up at the same time, so your not color changing as frequently. But on Siphons, they really ain't like what they used to be..Watch the review posted on the fine line conversion kit and then we'll discuss overspray LOL as 9/10 overspray isnt an airbrush issue, especially in mid and top end guns, its user issue.