Talon parts question

N

Neural

Guest
Ok, so it's late and I can't sleep. Most of you know my history with a problematic Talon.
I decided to experiment with it, and see if I could at least track down this problem where it backflows all on it's own.

As I purchased the multi-needle set with fan tip, I have some parts to work with here.

Here is what I have tested so far using water as the fluid(and yes, I realize some of these would have their own problems for practical use, but this was fully experimental):
1) I removed the #3 needle, tip, and cap, and put in the #2 parts
result: no backflow, proper airbrush function with just the water.
2) I removed the #2 cap, and put the #3 cap on with the #2 needle/tip.
result: no backflow, proper airbrush function
3) I put the #3 tip and needle back in, and used the "fan" cap
result: backflow problem.
4) #3 needle, tip, and cap
result: backflow problems

I didn't do any other experimentation such as using the #3 tip with the #2 needle, because I was concerned it would damage the needle or something along those lines.

After inspecting the needles and the caps, etc., the only piece in my experiments is the #3 tip (picture attached).
Unfortunately I can't see inside of it very well, but from what I can see, it's clean.

I'm starting to wonder if this has been my problem all along, but I have little experience with these parts. I understand the basics on how backflow works. You close off the normal air path, and it forces air back past the needle and into the cup, but I don't understand how it is happening in this situation.

Is it possible the very end of the tip is misshapen or too large?

I did give it a soak in restorer and then cleaned it with a bottle brush. Is it possible the bottle brush caused the very end of the tip to push outwards?

TalonNo3Tip.jpg
 
We will figure this out sometime...lol
If you look at the left picture, it looks like there is a crack at the end of the tip. Never use a bottle brush to clean with. There is a metal core in these and they will screw up your parts. I use an old needle or a toothpick that has been widdled down a bit to lightly scrape, clean any crap that builds up inside.
I always set my needle to the tip before using it using either water or cleaner. I put a little of fluid in the cup, undo the needle chuck and while pushing down for air only, lightly and slowly move the needle away from the tip while also twisting the needle as you do so. It will start spraying....now slowly while still twisting, move the needle towards the tip until the spray stops. Tighten the chuck and now using the trigger push for air and pull back to see how the fluid sprays out. It takes a light touch and this will help not to ram the needle to far into the tip causing cracks. I do find these brushes need to be treated very lightly...

Another thing I have noticed is that if the tip is not tightened enough you will get bubbles in your cup. Using the wrench supplied, I always give it a slight extra snug up. I am not saying over tighten, just that little extra to snug it up....
And a little bit of extra info....did you know that the o-ring that is between the back cover and the brush body, is the same o-ring that is between the cap and the body....sort of like an extra spare...lol
Another thing I have noticed, is that sometimes the caps are not machined like they should be and have a small burr and are not perfectly round. I have a real small file and have used this to clean it up a little....again using a feather touch....I have a cap that only worked when I used 2 o-ring on the cap and snugged it like that....It worked in my case for a crappy cap and tip match up until I got a new one.

The needle bearing inside the brush is also adjustable and if you find the needle does not glide smoothly when using the #3 needle, loosen the needle bearing using a long small flat screw driver. It just takes a 1/4 turn or so. Do not loosen too much or you will loose the seal and get paint back into the body....Not fun....I have found a sweet spot that allows me to use all 3 set ups with out adjusting it, but it took a bit of playing to find it...

Good luck and hope this helps
 
I can see your issue in the left hand part of your photo - the tip of the nozzle is cracked. If you look at the bright white highlight that is on the tapered part of the nozzle, and follow it all the way to the very edge of the tip, look at the left hand edge of the white part, but at the rear edge of the nozzle tip... Air will enter here.

Dunno, looking at it larger, it could be a highlight - but check this area -
TalonNo3Tip.jpg
 
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