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Lighting your work area

Discussion in 'General Airbrush Discussion' started by Joe T, Jun 3, 2018.


  1. Joe T

    Joe T Mac-Valve Maestro! Very Likeable!

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    so, I moved my AB work area to the basement with more room but less light. I have a finished basement that has can lights in the ceiling. What I’m finding is shadows as I paint are driving me nuts! I put a led over my easel but now I get a shadow underneath my hand when on my easel.

    Anyone have any lighting tips to evenly light your easel or work area. I will say I like the basement better, less dust and more comfy.

    Have a great day folks.

    Joe
  2. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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  3. Malky

    Malky Pencil Pushing Protagonist Very Likeable!

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    I have a 60 cm x 60 cm led 6000k panel, because it is a panel shadows are not so bad, but you can put a diffuser between yiyr lap and your work, while you might not get rid of shadows entirely they will be less intense, using a diffuser will likely reduce the amount of light you get but s stronger bulb will solve this problem.

    Another solution is to uplight, meaning you can place your lamp so that it shines upwards and hang a white sheet angled towards your work, this will reflect the light on your work with little or no shadow.

    It's virtually impossible to have absolutely no shadow but you can get it to the point where it's easy to ignore it.
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2018
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  4. huskystafford

    huskystafford Needle chucking Ninja

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    you can use 2 bulbs. One needs to hit from the left, the second one needs to hit from the right. And you eliminate shadows.

    edit: you will have slight shadow on the area where it won't bother you.
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  5. huskystafford

    huskystafford Needle chucking Ninja

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  6. huskystafford

    huskystafford Needle chucking Ninja

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    first 25 seconds of video :D
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  7. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Thats kind of a cool setup. with the three lights that adjust or whatever
    The rest is a lot of really dumb spin. $70 for an led that imitates incandescent.
    If the blue light from flourescents and leds keeps you awake maybe just turn it off???LOL
  8. J000seph

    J000seph Detail Decepticon! Very Likeable!

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    I just aim my light from the left so that the shadow is on the other side of my hand.
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  9. Malky

    Malky Pencil Pushing Protagonist Very Likeable!

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    Sometimes I just work in the dark:confused::)
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  10. Nessus

    Nessus Gravity Guru

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    I think the idea is not how the light behaves while one is sleeping (as you say, it would presumably be off), but rather to have indoor lighting that mimics the way outdoor sunlight shifts over the course of the day. Not mimicking an incandescent daylight bulb, but rather dynamically mimicking the changes in direction, intensity, and specra of sunlight as the sun moves across the sky. The theory being that our brains are hard coded to use sunlight to help set our internal clock. Theoretically, by spending a significant part of one's day under steady artificial light rather than sunlight (or steady unchanging sunlight, as in the case of astronauts), you're making that part of your brain prone to confusion.

    I think there there are problems with that idea (if that is the idea). Lots of people live in places where the weather makes the natural sunlight chaotic (on-and-off overcast skies, and other things like that), so if such a system were to exist in the brain, it would have to VERY forgiving. Still, even if it' only a loose system with lots of redundancy provided by other systems, it does seem plausible that having such lighting in offices and shops and the like probably would be a nice quality of life boost for the people who work there.

    And marketing aside, the idea of an LED bank as a phased array instead of just a block of lights or a screen is full of amazing potential uses. It's one of those things that makes you go "OF COURSE!" like a mad scientist when you hear it, and realize that it was both inevitable, and that this is exactly the time when this would become technically and commercially viable.

    I mean, that's what it is: an LED phased array. It's so straight forward that I'm not even sure it's patentable (specific hardware/software designs, sure, but not the general idea), so I wouldn't be surprised if competition and even DIY stuff starts to pop up. Somewhere out there someone is writing a Linux driver to turn an LED TV into a phased array light panel.

    Heck, with the right software, you could actually get a normal flat panel TV to project holograms this way. You'd need to double resolution a few more times before you could get holograms of a resolution comparable to a flat TV image, but the hardware would literally just be a high-res ordinary TV.
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2018
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  11. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Even so....it's a lot of spin in that video for something that is essentially a color changing LED on a timer.

    Phased array , beam steering, sure all kinds of applications there but thats in a whole other league from what they were showing.

    Even the whole shadowless deal they showed did not seem to me to be a system with that level of complexity....It looked to me more like a simple stereo lighting system where they were using three panels made up of a number of small adjustable lights which adjusted their intensity based on scanning the area they were projected to...basically turning up the lights that could still reach the area that was blocked to the other light while turning the others down to match. Still with poor scanning as often this meant there was an extremely hard shadow outline until someone held still long enough and the blocked area was small enough. I guess thats kind of the idea of a phased array without actually doing any beam steering. Had it been a single panel It would be woah! Beam steering over like 3ft with light and getting around something wider than a hair would be incredible.

    IDK its not exactly my area of expertise.
  12. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Actually I bet with the right software you could currently get a limited hologram from one of those tv's with the convex screen rather than flat by divding the surface into three sections and then attempting to beam steer to widen the intersecting area a bit, Probably would be only faintly visible in a very dark room and possibly need some sort of "one-way" mirror to deflect some of the ambient light bleeding from the screen. IDK first thoughts after reading your post and without any real studying of the subject.
  13. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    well after looking into it a little , actually seems like the lcd thing couldnt really work anyhow without 1. removing the polarizers 2. stacking the screens and 3. projecting an array of lasers through it and then for practicalities sake using several sets of these in stereo to leave room for the steered beams each taking about 10-40 times the room they would normally take...or like you said doubling the resolution several times and still stacking 10 screens sans polarizers. Though the further you could project the image from the screen the bigger you could make it and less resolution you would need in the screens since at the distance from the screen that the screen is wide the hologram should be about 1/4th the size of the screens but take up all of them for steering.

    Interesting subject though, Thanks for spurring me into sort of checking that out....some stuff i hadnt really thought about.
  14. Nessus

    Nessus Gravity Guru

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    Actually it doesn't need to be that complex. A hologram is traditionally produced by that type of diffraction, but it doesn't have to be. There are simpler methods, they just haven't lent themselves as well to high res holography on a human scale.

    One of my dad's best friends was a holography researcher, and when he was doing his college work back in the 70s, they'd create simple holograms using ASCII printouts. They'd design it using a simple computer program, print it out on a dot matrix printer, and tape the sheets up onto the wall in a big tiled image. If you stood close enough to see the individual ASCII characters, it just looked like ASCII, but if you stepped back far enough, the whole thing would resolve into a wall-sized hologram of a simple geometric shape.

    Other iterations were designed to be transmission holograms instead of viewable on the wall, so they'd take 35mm slide photos of the wall, and when developed, the slides would be crude but functional transmission holograms.

    This wasn't actually the point: the point was the software and the theoretical maths that went into it. This was just the only way they had to test the output with their limited means and the tech of the time.

    But I've always thought that an architect could do amazing things with that. Imagine a large building with cladding or widow glass etched to create a hologram covering the entire side. With individual lines physically cut at that size, it could be well robust enough to survive the elements*. This would've been doable decades ago in a simplified form, but a modern architect could go really wild with the computer design end. Think of baking a normal map on a CG model, then imagine that process used to design a hologram to be applied to the skin of a building. You could have buildings that from a distance of half a block or more trick the eye into thinking they're a different, more complex, or even physically impossible shape, within the bounds of their silhouette.

    A modern HD TV could do the exact same trick as-is, you just need the software to generate the image. It would take a larger block of pixels to create a hologram of a given shape compared to an ordinary 2D image, but all you need is the ability to display light and dark lines/shapes of sufficient granularity. This should be entirely doable right now with off-the-shelf TVs for very simple low-res holograms, It's just a matter of whether anyone's actually thought to do it (I imagine so, actually: there were a lot of 3D tv projects in the works back in the early 2010s, so this probably has been done in some corporate R&D lab more than once).

    Technically this doesn't require any phased array stuff. That would be more for postprocessing the holography data to be displayed at a wider array of viewing angles, or to actively target the viewing angle(s) based on viewer tracking sensors.


    *There's a church down the road from where I live that has a huge gold dome on top. The dome looks like a solid, semigloss gold leaf because of its size, but it's actually thousands of 1" square gold ceramic tiles. The sunlight reflects off the dome in the shape of a huge cross. The church likes to tell people this is a miracle and nobody understands how it happens, but any first year photography student can tell you EXACTY how it happens, and could duplicate it. On a more middling scale, people sometimes accidentally create holographic hand prints that "float" over the surface of their car by hand polishing the body with abrasive compounds, and you can even manually draw simple holograms on a clear or glossy surface using a scribing compass. That's angled surface diffraction, unlike what I was describing above, but either way: it would actually be trivial to design a hologram that could be CNC or laser etched into panels, so that gold church dome could project a detailed, fully stylized, undistorted cross floating "inside" or in front of the dome. TBH, I'm VERY surprised nothing like this been done yet, and can only guess that it's because there just aren't many architects who know about holography.

    I mean... even the wall of ASCII hologram thing would be very eye catching on, say, the wall of a clothing store. And with modern printing (or even 70s commercial printing instead of a students dot matrix printer) it could probably get some decent-ish resolution for the types of graphics that are usually found in such contexts.
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2018
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  15. Malky

    Malky Pencil Pushing Protagonist Very Likeable!

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    o_O WOW!!! What a read, so much information just to help choose a lightbulb, I think it would probably be loads cheaper to just work outdoors:)
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  16. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Sounds similar to what was done with the nintendo 3ds. but it used 2 layer screens and the light dark line trick combined.
    Seems to be some catch I dont really grasp why a regular lcd isnt totally usable....IDK....I could see using one to create dot matrix holograms on the fly but ...?
    I am surprised there isnt more use of the diffraction holograms or like you say large scale dot matrix holograms....I wonder if there is some element that makes them less practical than it seems???
  17. Robbyrockett2

    Robbyrockett2 Air-Valve Autobot!

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    Hmm.... I have a CNC and plenty of programs to do lines,dots, or whatever would be required.....I'm gonna have to study up on some of those simpler hologram types and the whole dot matrix thing......Could make for some very interesting aluminum panels. I might need your help or some more examples to figure out what exactly im looking for though

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